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wodgina6722
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« Reply #220 on: September 06, 2008, 07:53:27 AM » |
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Looks delicious Lex! Mines very similar, I still add 3/4 tsp of azomite a day. Slightly more salt. Mines tweaked with 200 grams of suet a day and higher protein seems better for me.
Anyone who says Raw Paleo is too time consuming/expensive/difficult need only look at our examples, It could not be any easier, especially if you live in the states, 3 days food in minutes.
I make mine daily for no reason other than I just got into a routine for now but I may change. I get my suet solid then I defrost it during the day, I add the suet and ground beef in my food processor with Azomite, Himalayan salt and maybe a chunk of organ meat.
My food processor is a Breville Ikon BFP650 with 900 watt motor. Its the one with a stainless steel facade so it looks cool in my kitchen. I've given it a real thrashing (sometimes I throw in semi frozen suet) since I've bought it and its going strong. I don't wash it either just keep the bowl in the fridge.
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lex_rooker
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« Reply #221 on: September 06, 2008, 12:52:55 PM » |
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Hi Andrew, I used to prepare my food each day but then thought how silly it was to spend almost the same amount of time each day to mix a single meal worth of food when I could prepare several day's worth in the same amout of time. The best part is that I only have to clean up the mess twice a week instead of every day.
I also use to thaw chunks of fat and grind it with a small hand grinder that clamped to the table at the time I prepared my food. Now I grind all the fat at one time when I receive it (usually about 20 lbs at a time) and then freeze it in gallon sized Ziploc bags. It takes about 15 minutes to grind all 20 lbs and then I only have to clean up that mess once a month or so. I built my own power grinder for another project, and it will tear through whole chickens, bones and all, without missing a beat. Motor is 1 1/2 horse power coupled to a #32 Choprite bolt down grinder. Weighs about 100 lbs.
Lex
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lex_rooker
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« Reply #222 on: September 07, 2008, 12:38:53 AM » |
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As those who follow my journal are aware, several weeks ago I was in a position where I was unable to eat my normal food and had to make do with typical cafeteria fare. I experienced some unpleasant side effects from this in the form of large amounts of water retention even though I did my best to eat only protein and fat and consume no obvious carbs.
Two weeks ago my wife and I attended a summer family gathering and I decide to throw caution to the wind, eat all the forbidden foods, and see what would happen. The results are rather instructive and should be given consideration before a person decides to commit to a zero carb lifestyle.
The framework of the experiment was that I ate my normal meal during the day and then consumed a large amount of carbs in the evening between about 6pm and 9pm. The next day I returned to my normal meat only fare. Here’s what happened.
At 4pm I ate 1.5 lbs of raw meat and fat after which we headed off to attend the family gathering. Between 6pm and 9pm I ate the following: 6oz of 7Up, ½ dozen cheese and cracker appetizers 3 pieces of thin crust pepperoni pizza 2 large chocolate chip cookies 1 small scoop vanilla ice cream 1 large slice of watermelon ½ cantaloupe
I found that the more I ate the more I wanted to eat of these foods. My intention was to eat one piece of pizza, (after all I had already eaten a full portion of my normal food and really wasn’t all that hungry), but found myself going back for seconds and thirds. Chocolate Chip Cookies are my favorite and I justified 2 as it was “only this one time and I deserve it”. Probably my favorite thing in the world is ice cream and I would have loved more but they ran out. Large plates of sliced melons were available all night long and I found myself picking up a piece every time I walked by them even though by this time I was pretty well stuffed – I still wanted more. We finally left about 9pm and my binge was forced to an end.
By 10pm I noticed that I was very thirsty and just couldn’t get enough to drink. I checked BG and it had risen in to the low 200s. It might have gone higher but I didn’t start measuring until I got home.
I went to bed about 11pm and woke up twice during the night from thirst and each time consumed 16 oz of water. BG started to fall but this process was very slow. It took almost 24 hours to get back down below 100. My thirst continued for about 36 hours and during that time my weight increased by about 12 lbs, and my ankles, feet, and hands swelled up with edema. I was very uncomfortable to say the least. Even though I returned to my normal diet the next day, my thirst continued for about a day and half and I continued to gain weight during that period. I’d say that I hit the peak at about 48 hours before things started to reverse.
On the 3rd day I started feeling better but I was really puffed up with fluid retention. When I stood for long periods (working in my shop) fluid would pool in my lower legs, feet and ankles making them stiff and painful due to stretching of the skin. I’d go to bed and throughout the night the fluid would redistribute more evenly throughout my body and I would wake up with my hands noticeably stiff and swollen, but legs and ankles less so.
After the 4th day I began to see a slow drop in weight and this continued at the rate of about one pound per day over the next week and a half until now I’m almost back to normal.
Of course I really have no idea of what is actually happening but here are the conclusions I’ve drawn from this experience:
My guess is that, after 3 years of zero carb, my body is no longer conditioned to handle large carb loads efficiently. Insulin production is probably low and when BG was suddenly and unexpectedly driven very high, my body called for large amounts of water in an attempt to dilute BG to bring it down to safe levels.
I have had small amounts of carbs in the past, but in very small amounts, a single bite of something just to taste it as an example. This might have amounted to 5g of carbs and this caused no detectable problem, but clearly large infusions of carbs are now a problem for me.
My previous experience with the cafeteria food suggests that since I experienced the same symptoms as with this current experiment, there must have been a significant amount of hidden carbs in what I was eating. Maybe sugar in the sausage, lactose in the cheese, and eggs may have more available carbs than expected. Also it took much longer for the edema to develop, though it was just as severe, so it seems that lower levels of carb intake over an extended period of time will exceed the body’s capacity to handle ever rising BG levels once the body has shut down those systems through adaptation to a zero carb diet.
It took several months for my body to adapt to zero carbs and during that time I was rather uncomfortable. I think that if I were to decide to return to a high carb diet, I would face a similar period of adaptation back to where my body handled carbs efficiently again. I think this is an important consideration for anyone contemplating adopting a zero carb lifestyle. You should not make this decision lightly.
Don't take this to assume that I'm now sorry for being zero carb - nothing could be further from the truth. My health has improved dramatically, and I have a much better quality of life. I can do things today that I couldn't do as recently as 5 years ago, and at an age when most are taking more and more medications while at the same time having to reduce their activity levels, I'm off all meds but one, have reduced my single remaining medicaton to 1/4 the original amount, and increased my activity levels almost to what I was doing in my mid 30's. The trade-off of now being forced to restrict my carb intake or suffer the rather unpleasant consequences is well worth it for me.
Lex
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boxcarguy07
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« Reply #223 on: September 07, 2008, 02:41:26 AM » |
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Very interesting little experiment, Lex. Boy, you really pigged out! I wonder how my body would react to a large amount of carbs, now that I only eat a bit of fruit each day. Right now has been the longest time since I've been raw that I haven't broken my diet at all. I used to get big cravings for certain foods, but now I crave meat!  I'm sure one of these days I'll be breaking my diet for a social reason or something, so I guess we'll see then.
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TylerDurden
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« Reply #224 on: September 07, 2008, 03:22:45 AM » |
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I'm impressed, Lex. So many other online groups focus on opinions/studies etc., but you at least prefer to rely on your own experiences and measure them, regardless of others' opinions.
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"The price good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men." -Plato
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wodgina6722
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« Reply #225 on: September 07, 2008, 07:42:01 AM » |
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Thanks for the information I will be careful in indulging carbs but I will continue with zero carb until I reach 6 months then reevaluate.
It reminds me of of when I ate a pizza last year when a good mate come over, I was on RVAF at the time and hadn't touched wheat for over a year. I passed out about an hour ofter finishing it, I felt drugged it didn't feel like sleep. When I came out of it I was so exhausted I could hardly make it to bed. I was so thirsty that night just kept getting up and drinking and drinking. Wheat is a drug for me.
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Satya
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« Reply #226 on: September 07, 2008, 08:38:45 AM » |
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As those who follow my journal are aware, several weeks ago I was in a position where I was unable to eat my normal food and had to make do with typical cafeteria fare. I experienced some unpleasant side effects from this in the form of large amounts of water retention even though I did my best to eat only protein and fat and consume no obvious carbs.
Two weeks ago my wife and I attended a summer family gathering and I decide to throw caution to the wind, eat all the forbidden foods, and see what would happen. The results are rather instructive and should be given consideration before a person decides to commit to a zero carb lifestyle.
The framework of the experiment was that I ate my normal meal during the day and then consumed a large amount of carbs in the evening between about 6pm and 9pm. The next day I returned to my normal meat only fare. Here’s what happened.
At 4pm I ate 1.5 lbs of raw meat and fat after which we headed off to attend the family gathering. Between 6pm and 9pm I ate the following: 6oz of 7Up, ½ dozen cheese and cracker appetizers 3 pieces of thin crust pepperoni pizza 2 large chocolate chip cookies 1 small scoop vanilla ice cream 1 large slice of watermelon ½ cantaloupe
<snip>
I am actually a bit shocked that someone who has been eating such a pristine, zero carb diet would indulge in such obviously inerior fare to such an extent. I can't imagine, personally, doing such a thing, and I am not 100% raw nor a carnivore eating the same basic diet day in, day out. I never consume more than the occasional dairy or legume in terms of non paleo foods. Eating junk food all night would definitely be a zinger to the body, as you experienced (now for the second time after the cafteria escapade). But is there any real value in such an experiment of extremities? It is - in my mind - much like lighting a match and sticking your hand over it. Yes, it is going to hurt. So why do it again? I mean absolutely no disrespect. And I do understand that we are all in our own realms of reality. I just cannot imagine any constructive outcomes from such a romp in junk food land, especially one paved with a ton of processed wheat foods.
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lex_rooker
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« Reply #227 on: September 07, 2008, 09:21:22 AM » |
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Satya, What I did is what 99% of the "civilized" world does every day. Ask the typical American to review what I ate at a "party" and they'd most likely think it standard fare and rather mild at that since no booze was consumed.
I had two things in mind when I did this. First, I wanted to verify that the problem I experienced from the cafeteria food was probably caused by carbs even though I couldn't see that I was eating any. By eating a bunch of carbs and getting the same reaction, I pretty much verified that this was the case. The other possibility was some chemical that is common in restaurant food but not it homemade fare - like MSG or sulfite's - which can cause a similar reaction in some people. I've now ruled out the MSG/chemical idea and can pin it on the carbs.
Second, I was warned by Mary on the Saturated Fat Forum that if I allowed my body to adapt to ketones as a primary fuel, that I'd have real problems eating the occasional high carb meal as the production of insulin and probably some important enzymes needed to handle carbs efficiently would shut down. It appears that something of this sort actually happens and I've reported the results of this bit of extravagance to her.
I seldom take anyone's word for anything, especially when they really can't point to actual experience or a relatively unbiased study that supports their position. This was an easy experiment to do, and in the grand scheme of things, relatively harmless, yet provided real information for real people to help them make more informed decisions on how best to live their lives.
Next up is the "all fat, all the time" experiment for Elli. For this one it will be important to monitor BG very closely as the whole point is to see if there is any correlation between BG and meals comprised of only fat and no protein. I'll be taking another week to allow my body to get back to normal and then start this one. I don't expect this to have such lingering effects as the carb experiment did, but only time will tell.
Stay tuned,
Lex
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lex_rooker
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« Reply #228 on: September 07, 2008, 11:15:22 AM » |
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Tyler, I've found most formal studies and ALL opinions, (including my own  ), heavily biased. I like to think that the difference between me and the other guys is that I clearly state my bias, offer my opinions as opinions and not fact, and try to support the conclusions I draw with evidence from experiments that others can easily duplicate. I also try to honestly report my failures as well as my successes. To portray the zero-carb lifestyle as a panacea would be dishonest. The carb loading experiment clearly shows that choosing a zero carb lifestyle has some significant trade-offs. This is important information for someone considering such a radical change. It has worked well for me, however, I think most people would be better served by a less radical approach like Low Carb or Very Low Carb. They would probably get most, if not all, of the benefit, yet be able to handle the occasional carb overdose much better than I do with my commitment to zero carb. The less radical approaches would certainly make it easier to fit into the occasion social situation and family gatherings. Anyone who thinks this is unimportant just doesn't understand the powerful and important role that culture, community, and family play in our lives. Well, off my soap box and back to zero carb, Lex
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Satya
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« Reply #229 on: September 08, 2008, 01:50:30 AM » |
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Well, Lex, you certainly are a brave trailblazer! I do hope you suffer no adverse health reactions from any of your experiments. You do our community a great service by your continued reports. I guess as a gluten intolerant gal, I just can't imagine doing the crappy wheat products ever again.
Oh, btw. You mentioned that there were no preservatives or additives in the family gathering food. Are you sure? Was everything homemade with all-natural ingredients? Food additives are everywhere in the SAD foods.
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